Comments on: What if the SAE Frat Boys Are, In Fact, “Real Sooners”? http://www.secondshiftblog.com/2015/03/sae-frat-boys-fact-real-sooners/ Thu, 12 Nov 2015 08:44:25 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.4.2 By: kevin j http://www.secondshiftblog.com/2015/03/sae-frat-boys-fact-real-sooners/#comment-11500 Thu, 12 Mar 2015 02:25:44 +0000 http://www.secondshiftblog.com/?p=697#comment-11500 SA: I’ve been reading a lot of stuff recently on counterpublic theory, but I need to read more. I’m curious how useful this might be for thinking about how more restorative models of communication and expression have developed historically through alternative institutions in domains like community mental health, which in turn might serve as future models. Is there any good stuff you know of on digital/internet counterpublics? Just something I’ve been thinking about!

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By: SA Smythe http://www.secondshiftblog.com/2015/03/sae-frat-boys-fact-real-sooners/#comment-11497 Wed, 11 Mar 2015 21:55:53 +0000 http://www.secondshiftblog.com/?p=697#comment-11497 Thanks for your response, Kevin, it was really thoughtful. You write, “Also, I’m not entirely sure what a “restorative” approach here would actually look like, since there are not really any existing institutions in place here that could claim to perform such a function that would *also* be accountable to the public.”

I totally understand the difficulties of imagination, especially for something for which we have no models. The politics of abolition is based on such futurity. I also have a more, say, Warnerian/Berlantian/Habermasian idea of a “public” and I definitely think the university is one, especially if, with a vision of restorative justice and abolition praxis the university is decolonised. It’s a tall, tall order and like I said in my post, I applauded Boren too for his outrage and trying to respond/be responsible. Moreover though I am grateful for how I was moved by this whole deal to think outside of retribution and try to think about what another kind of world could be, even if I don’t know how to concretely adhere to that kind of worldview yet.

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By: SA Smythe http://www.secondshiftblog.com/2015/03/sae-frat-boys-fact-real-sooners/#comment-11496 Wed, 11 Mar 2015 21:50:34 +0000 http://www.secondshiftblog.com/?p=697#comment-11496 Thanks, Emma! I didn’t realise you were an Okie. Also, I like that we’re responding to each other–I was moved to respond to your Ana Tijoux piece a while back. Looking forward to hearing your perspective on the SAE aftermath.

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By: kevin j http://www.secondshiftblog.com/2015/03/sae-frat-boys-fact-real-sooners/#comment-11482 Wed, 11 Mar 2015 01:54:49 +0000 http://www.secondshiftblog.com/?p=697#comment-11482 I’m very sympathetic to the underlying sentiment about restorative justice, etc. At the same time, as someone who grew up in Oklahoma the first 24 years of his life witnessing some pretty awful, intergenerational, and systemic white supremacy, I have to tip my hat to Boren here. This might also be the Foucault in me speaking, but it sure seems to me that making this punishment a public spectacle of shame and exclusion is in reality the only way that the public at large will ever feel that any sense of justice has been meted out at all, if only at a symbolic level (not to mention the benefits a punitive approach has in stimulating public discussion about larger systemic issues). Also, I’m not entirely sure what a “restorative” approach here would actually look like, since there are not really any existing institutions in place here that could claim to perform such a function that would *also* be accountable to the public. With that said, we should be building such institutions modeled on restorative justice and public accountability; so there, I’m def with you. At the same time, when faced with instances of toxic, systemic and intergenerational white supremacy, there’s little doubt that restorative models, while perhaps necessary, are far from sufficient. In any case, these are crucial questions to be asking – great post!

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By: Emma http://www.secondshiftblog.com/2015/03/sae-frat-boys-fact-real-sooners/#comment-11481 Wed, 11 Mar 2015 01:32:51 +0000 http://www.secondshiftblog.com/?p=697#comment-11481 Thanks for this great piece, SA. As an Okie ex-pat, I have been horrified by the latest in what seems to be a never ending stories of vitriolic hatred in Oklahoma. This is certainly not an incident contained to one chapter of a Greek organization, rather, as you suggest, this event is connected to deeper problems of rampant racism in the Sooner State. (More on this soon in a response blog.)

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